Bye bye, Sola Scriptura!
It appears to be a question of either/or, which means one or the other for non-Catholic Christians.
Non-Catholic Christians have chosen the Bible, since they rejected the Church which Jesus Christ founded.
Well, now in regards to itself, just what does the Bible have to say about the Church that Jesus Christ founded?
Does the Bible say it was the Bible? No, it says He founded His Church, Matthew 16:18.
Does the Bible say it is the Bible? No, it says it is the Church, 1Timothy 3:15.
This verse also tells us that the Church was already in existence before 1Timothy was written.
Does the Bible say it is the Bible? No, it says it is the Church, Matthew 18:15-18.
Does the Bible say it is the Bible? No, it says it is the Church, Ephesians 3:10.
Does the Bible say that all who believe in Sola Scriptura, (the 'Bible only'), will be saved?
No, it says those who are attached to His Church will be saved.
"And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved", Acts 2:47, King James Bible.
Note the singular, "the church".
Does the Bible say that we are to edify the Bible?
No, it says we are to edify the Church, 1Corinthians 14:12.
Does the Bible say it is the Bible?
No, the Bible says it is the Bishops that the Holy Spirit has appointed that rule the Church of GOD, Acts 20:28.
Does the Bible say it is the Bible?
No, the Bible says that Jesus purchased the Church of GOD with His own blood, Acts 20:28, King James Bible.
Does the Bible say it was the Bible?
No, the Bible says that Christ gave Himself up for the Church, Ephesians 5:25.
Does the Bible say it is the Bible?
No, the Bible says that Jesus nourishes and cherishes His Church, Ephesians 5:29.
Does the Bible say it is the Bible?
No, the Bible says Jesus is the savior of His Body which is the Church that He founded, Ephesians 1:22-23, and 5:23.
Does the Bible say it is the Bible?
No, the Bible says it is the Church that Jesus Christ founded, Ephesians 5:27.
The Church is not holy because of us. The Church is holy because of Him.
Does the Bible say it is the Bible?
No, the Bible says the Church is subject to Christ, Ephesians 5:24.
Does the Bible say it is the Bible?
No, the Bible says we are to give no offence to the Church of GOD, 1Corinthians 10:32.
Do you give offence to the Church of GOD that Jesus Christ founded?
Does the Bible say it was the Bible?
No, but it tells us that the Church was already in existence for years before any New Testament books were even written.
How do we know this?
Because it is the Church which is mentioned in these books:
Matthew 16:18 and 18:17,
Acts 5:11, for one and many more times in Acts,
Romans 16:23, and many more verses,
1Corinthians 1:2, and many more verses,
2Corinthians 1:1,
Galatians 1:13,
Ephesians 1:22, and many more verses,
Philippians 3:6 and 4:15,
Colossians 1:18, and many more verses,
1Thessalonians 1:1. 1Thessalonians is considered to be the first New Testament book written, in about 51 A.D..
2Thessalonians 1:1,
1Timothy 3:5, 3:15 and 5:16,
Titus 3:15, per added note in the King James Version,
Philemon 1:2,
Hebrews 2:12 and 12:23,
James 5:14,
1Peter 5:13,
3John 1:6 and 1:9-10,
Revelation 2:1, plus six more in the same book.
Since all of these books mention the word Church, the Church had to have been in existence already for years before they were written.
If that is true, then how was the teaching accomplished without a New Testament of Jesus Christ?
Simply by the same way that Jesus Christ taught, orally. Oral teaching is Tradition.
Tradition (capital 'T') is Apostolic oral teaching handed down to their successors and to others.
The Bible is oral Tradition written down.
There was no such thing as Sola Scriptura even then.
There was not any New Testament scripture for the first twenty years of the existence of the Church.
Written by Bob Stanley, April 28, 2007
Updated September 28, 2007
Have I then become your enemy, because I told you the truth?"
Galatians 4:16
"What is gratuitously asserted can be gratuitously denied."What does the Bible say about itself?
In other words, statements made without proof can be denied without proof.
10 comments:
Michael, I just came across your blog which asks several questions about the church and scriptures. The church is definitely an important topic for the believer. If we do not understand the questions surrounding it we will come to wrong conclusions and beliefs.
The church exists in and through Jesus Christ, and so is a distinctive New Testament reality. At the same time it is continuous with Israel, the seed of Abraham and God's covenant people. The new covenant under which the church lives (1 Cor. 11:25; Heb. 8:7-13) isa new form of the relationship in which God says to His chosen community, "I will be your God, and you shall be my people." (Jer. 7:23, 31:33)
Under the new covenant the Old Testament sacrifices and rituals and sanctuary have been superseded by the mediation of Jesus. (He. 1-10)
Believers in Christ are the seed of Abraham and the people of God. (Gal. 3;29)The New Testament teaches that the church is the fulfillment of the Old Testament hopes and patterns, brought about by jesus Christ. The church is the family and flock of God (John 10:16; Eph. 2:18; 3:15; 4:6; 1 Peter 5:2-4, His Israel (Gal. 6:16), the body and bride of christ (Eph.1:22-23; 5:23-32; Rev. 19:7;21:2, 9-27) and the temple of the Holy Spirit (1 Cor. 3;16, Eph. 2:19-22).
The church is a single worshiping community, permanently gathered in the true sanctuary, the heavenly jerusalem (Gal. 4:26; Heb. 12:22-24) and the place of God's presence. The church is one, although the worshiping community consists of the church militant-those who are still on earth- and the church triumphant-those who have died and entered glory. On earth the church appears in its local congregations, each one a microcosm of the church as a whole.
The church on earth is one in Christ despite the great number of local congregations and denominations (Eph. 4:3-6).
Note also that there is a distinction to be drawn between the church as people see it (visible church) and as God alone sees it (invisible church). This difference in the historic distinction distinction does not mean that no part of it can be seen, but that its exact boundary is not known to us. Only God knows (2 Tim. 2:19) which menbers of the earthly congregations are born again and so belong to the church as an eternal and spiritual fellowship. Jesus taught that there would be false believers, professors rather than possessors of the new birth.
Knowing all this I would suggest that there are believers and unbelievers in both Catholic and Protestant traditions.
The church on earth is one in Christ despite the great number of local congregations and denominations (Eph. 4:3-6).
Dear Scooter
The Family of GOD...
The Communion of Saints
The Church is a family. The Church Militant (on earth), Church Suffering (in Purgatory), and Church Triumphant (in Heaven) are not three divisions of the Catholic Church, but are united in one family in the Communion of Saints.
The Communion of Saints is a communion of the living, not of the dead. The Communion of Saints is the Church, CCC 946.
The Church, then, is 'The Holy People of GOD', and her members are called 'saints', CCC 823. (CCC is the Catechism of the Catholic Church)
The Family of GOD was built up by GOD through the covenants He made with man.
The first covenant GOD made with man is the one with Adam. This can be seen as the marital covenant, the first step of a family organization.
The second covenant was made with Noah, and this can be seen as the household covenant, since Noah and his family were the only ones who were saved in the ark.
Next came the covenant with Abraham, or the tribal covenant. Abraham became the patriarch of many families united into one 'tribe'.
Then came the covenant with Moses where the various tribes were united into a national covenant.
After that came the Davidic covenant of the kingdom where there was formed a national kingdom.
Lastly, the new covenant of Jesus Christ, was instituted, where all men are united into one body, the body of Christ in an international world wide family of GOD, the Holy Roman Catholic Church.
"I am the GOD of Abraham, and the GOD of Isaac, and the GOD of Jacob.
I am not the GOD of the dead but of the living." (Matthew 22:32, Mark 12:26-27 )
"And behold, two men were talking with Him. And these were Moses and Elias, who, appearing in glory, spoke of His death, which He was about to fulfill in Jerusalem." (Luke 9:30-31).
Not only were these two Saints alive, but they spoke, and they even spoke to Him about future happenings.
"And I tell you that many will come from the east and from the west, and will feast with Abraham and Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven." (Matthew 8:11)
Does it sound like these three heroes of the Old Testament are not alive?
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So Michael, I have a question for you. Canon 16 of the Council of Trent states, “If anyone says that he will for certain, with an absolute and infallible certainty, have that great gift of perseverance even to the end… let him be anathema.” Now how would you explain this canon seemingly in direct opposition to the Bible. The apostle John wrote his epistle to believers of Jesus Christ, in order that you may know that you have eternal life (1 John 5:13). It is pretty obvious that God intends Christians to know where they stand in relation to Him rather than keeping their fingers crossed, doing as many good works as possible and then never being sure until the end?
Dear Scooter,
I was saved, I am saved and I am being saved.Yes, but only GOD knows who they are.
Dear Michael,
My question remains:do I trust the Vatican or do I believe the scriptures?
Dear Scooter,
PART ONE
THE PROFESSION OF FAITH
SECTION ONE
"I BELIEVE" - "WE BELIEVE"
CHAPTER THREE
MAN'S RESPONSE TO GOD
ARTICLE 2
WE BELIEVE
166 Faith is a personal act - the free response of the human person to the initiative of God who reveals himself. But faith is not an isolated act. No one can believe alone, just as no one can live alone.
You have not given yourself faith as you have not given yourself life. The believer has received faith from others and should hand it on to others.
Our love for Jesus and for our neighbour impels us to speak to others about our faith. Each believer is thus a link in the great chain of believers.
I cannot believe without being carried by the faith of others, and by my faith I help support others in the faith.
167 "I believe" (Apostles' Creed) is the faith of the Church professed personally by each believer, principally during Baptism.
"We believe" (Niceno-Constantinopolitan Creed) is the faith of the Church confessed by the bishops assembled in council or more generally by the liturgical assembly of believers.
"I believe" is also the Church, our mother, responding to God by faith as she teaches us to say both "I believe" and "We believe".
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Michael, You mentioned the church triumphant, militant and in purgatory. I can understand the first 2 but in 1 John 1 :7 we read that the blood of Christ cleanses from all sin. The blood of Christ “cleanses” –Greek “katharizo” – takes away all our sins. All sin. We are told that we are saved by grace through faith. (Rom. 5:2; Eph. 2:8) The Greek word for “repentance” is “metanoeo” which came in the Middle Ages to be understood as “to do penance”, but the Greek word means “to repent”. The blood of Christ cleanses from all sin when we repent and receive Him. So If the blood of Christ cleanses from all sin, can you explain why the Roman Catholic catechism imparted by the Roman Church – from the Vatican says you can atone in purgatory for your own sins? And why the temporal consequence of sin can in part be negated by indulgences?
Dear Scooter,
The Church Suffering
It is easy to understand the basic doctrinal difficulties with this setup.
The Church Suffering is suffering in Purgatory to remit the remainders of the temporal punishment due for sins already confessed and supposedly forgiven.
Since the Bible says nothing about this temporal punishment, Roman Catholic apologists rely on Tradition .
Hebrews 1:3 tells us that Christ, by Himself, effected our cleansing from sin.
The Roman Catholic Confraternity translation renders this passage "Christ has effected man's purgation from sin."
However, the Roman Catholic plan tells us that if we have any unpaid temporal punishment remaining when we die, we go to Purgatory .
The Roman Catholic St. Peter's Catechism solemnly tells us that all of the Suffering Church will get to Heaven when "they have atoned for their sins."
They atone in Purgatory through suffering.
The Bible has a different message. "For Christ hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God" (1 Peter 3:18).
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Thanks Michael, I appreciate the information.
Your welcome, Scooter!
God bless you!
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